Juliet's Genealogy

Gravatt Family History Research – the contradictory information on the net.

These extra research notes are pertinent to a branch of the Sussex Gravatts and my London Gravatt family. 

For reference I have:

My Gravatt Family Tree, 

Sussex Gravatts Family Tree (covers John Gravet born abt 1490 down to the children of John Grevatt and Sarah Jays up to 1800)

Will of John Gravatt of Windmill Street 1834

I have decided to do some extra Gravatt research in order to try and clarify and separate conflicting information I have seen on the internet. This is especially the case with ancestry.co.uk public member trees.  It could either prove or disprove a connection between the two branches (at least in this period of note, 1700s).  This may also help other researchers and clarify things for me as I go along.  It does get very confusing!

I have been researching my Gravatt line for many years – since mid 1980s. I have been stuck for some time on the origins of my 5 x Great Grandfather John Gravatt, a Newsman of Windmill Street, St. Luke’s, London, died in 1834 aged 70.   He had a son John, also a Newsman of Windmill Street.  He had died in 1822 and was buried at St. Luke’s.

Two important pieces of information came my way.

1. A Grave stone with inscriptions, proving the link between John born abt 1787 (son of John d 1834) and the other family members buried with him:

and

2.  The Will of John Gravatt senior dated 11 Jan 1834 in which he mentions two daughter-in-laws, a sister and nieces and grand children.

I already knew about John junior, and his sons his sons William and John but Mary from the grave stone was new information.  It seemed logical that she was John juniors’s mother.  And indeed I then found a marriage of John Gravatt to Mary Wright at St. Dunstan & All Saints, Stepney on 1st August, 1786.  They were both ‘of this parish’ in the Hamlet of Mile End Old Town. She was buried just 4 years before her husband John senior also at St. Lukes. 

From the Will

I pieced together John senior’s sibling Ann (Nanny in his will) and her family. She had 5 daughters with Thomas Horn, all from St Benett Paul’s Wharf, London together with the marriages of three of those daughters.  John senior’s will mentions nieces Hannah and Sophia Horn – these turned out to be the two that were still unmarried at the time of his will. Rebecca and Harriet were married in 1826 and 1824 respectively and the youngest daughter Rachel Martha had died in 1800, in infancy. 

One daughter-in-law mentioned is Hannah Gravatt, the widow of John Junior but I have been unable to track down the other daughter-in-law Sarah Barnes of Pentonville. This would suggest that John and Mary had another son who married a Sarah, died and then his widow remarried a Barnes.  I cannot find such a connection. 

The other niece he mentions in 1834 is Mrs Battice of Doncaster Place, Old Kent Road, a widow. I have recently discovered that this lady was in fact Sarah Myra Gravatt (Groveat) the daughter of John’s brother Thomas b 1761 which I did not know about previously (Thank you Debbie!) . She was in fact Mrs Batty, widowed in 1820 and remarried later in 1836. 

Who were the parents of John and Ann?

Who were the parents of John b abt 1764 and his sister Ann born abt 1757 and Thomas b abt 1761?  

Referring to my Gravatt Family Tree:

Scenario 1. Now that I know there was a brother Thomas as well as a sister Ann, I found a Thomas Gravet bp 22 March, 1761 at All Saints West Ham, the son of William and Mary (Brown) who were married on 4.6.1755.  I then found Ann! She was baptised on 7th March, 1757.  In fact I found six children in total but no John!!  Then I found a likely baptism for John Graven on 22nd January, 1764 on freereg. The same baptism was transcribed on ancestry as John Gravels. So this, subject to me finding the original register, is evidence enough that I know have John’s parents and his siblings. 

Scenario 2.  IF John as the son of John Gravatt and Ann Ryall (married 28 Aug 1764 at St James Westminster) born 24.10.1765 and baptised 14 Nov 1765, then he would have had a brother Richard baptised 22 March, 1767. Richard is not mentioned in his will so we can assume he had died by 1834.  Also is the above is true, I can find no baptism for a sister Ann in around 1757 – this would have been six years before John and Ann’s marriage. Either that or Ann Horn’s age at death is incorrect?  The marriage is also too late for brother Thomas born 1761.

Scenario 3.  Another option of our John is as the son of John Gravat and Ann, Tanner of Long Lane baptised on 29 April 1764 at St. Mary Magdalene, Bermondsey. I have also checked these registers for an Ann from 1756 to 1759 and not found anything.  My gut feeling is that these are not the correct parents. 

Ancestry

I started putting my family tree on ancestry.co.uk fairly recently and looked at various clues in the hope somebody out there were researching the same branches.

This is when I found a mass of conflicting information and was amazed to find that many people had attributed my 5 x Great Grandfather John Gravatt (abt 1764 – 1834) as the son of Thomas Gravet and Susannah Sayers/Sairs of Billingshurst and many also have my 4 x great grandfather John Gravatt who died in 1822 as being the son of John Gravatt and Sarah Jays. 

Referring to the  Sussex Gravatt family tree.

There is clearly a John Grevatt bp 24 Jan 1768 at Billingshurst, the son of Thomas and Susannah Sayers, but did this John marry Mary Wright in London in 1786 or Sarah Jays in Billingshurst in 1789?  I would wager the latter.  Although I realise that people did move to London to marry, live and work, if this is the John that left a will in 1834, he would have had a sister-in-law Ann Gravett (widow of a brother Thomas) and a brother Francis plus different nieces and nephews, from his siblings ie other children of Thomas and Susannah.  

There is also his son John born in 1787 who married Hannah Steedman and died before him in 1822.  Is he the John born in Billingshurst in 1791? There are in fact two Johns baptised at Billingshurst in 1791. One is son of John and Sarah Jays bp 19.6.1791 and the other is the son of John’s brother Thomas Gravatt and Ann Redman bp 19.5.1791.  So I set out to see if either of these could be my John d 1822. 

I looked at the 1841 census and found John Gravatt aged 50 living at Billingshurst. The same John appears in 1861 unmarried, born in Billingshurst.  I believe this John was buried on 3 Aug 1868 aged 77, ie born in 1791.  This would account for one of those Johns. I also found a John Gravatt buried 26 July 1820 at Pulborough aged 29 ie born in 1791. Pulborough was where Thomas and Susannah were buried and other members of the family were married. 

I have no idea which John died in 1820 and which died in 1868.  Either way, neither of them died in 1822 and was buried at St. Lukes, together with a Mary.  Ergo neither of them was born to Mary Wright and John Gravatt newsman.  Added to that when John and Mary Wright were married they were both “of this parish and the hamlet of Mile End Old Town”.  In which case John b abt 1764, died 1834 was not the son of Thomas and Susannah. 

PLEASE  let me know if you think I have any if this wrong.  I have tried to be systematic in my approach, but I may be missing something. What a shame marriage certificates naming fathers were not around before 1837!! 

Questions: 

1. Can anyone find the baptism of a John Gravatt born about 1787, son of John and Mary?  Other than John Graveat bp 19 Aug 1787 at West Ham All Saints, son of John and Mary Graveat.  There are other West Ham Gravatts including Sarah Mira Groveat, bp 2 May 1792, daughter of Thomas Groveat and Sarah.  So far this is my only lead!
2. Does anyone’s family tree account for Richard Gravatt, Banker of Fleet Street b abt 1740, died 1778 or his brother John Gravatt of St Giles in the Fields.

Please email me 

Sources

Public member trees in ancestry.co.uk

births, marriages and deaths from ancestry.co.uk

freeReg.org

familysearch.org

Billingshurst Parish Register Extracts by Marion Woolgar (happy to share)

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